Thinkpad Fn Ctrl Key
12 August 2006Well my first impression of the Thinkpad is that the FN and Ctrl Key should be swapped. I’m used to the Ctrl key being the furthest on the left. I use it a lot, for example, when I go to URL’s I press Ctrl - Enter instead of having to type the www and the .com in the address. I also use it a lot for copying ( ctrl - c) and pasting (ctrl - v). I wish there was a way I could reverse them. It appears to me that every other keyboard I’ve ever used has the ctrl key on the furthest left. Even all my standard keyboards for the desktops has the ctrl key on the left. This is too bad. I’m wondering if I can get use to it where it is. It just doesn’t seem correct to have the function key first, then ctrl.
Update:
Can someone try this program?
http://webpages.charter.net/krumsick/
People have been using it for the Apple keyboards. I don’t have a Thinkpad anymore to try it on. Let us know in the comments if it works.
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46 Responses to “Thinkpad Fn Ctrl Key”
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August 28th, 2006 at 7:46 am
Hi
could you please tell me, whether you have solved this Fn-Ctrl issue?? I seriously cannot live without Ctrl on most left, and I do not know what to do.
(I will probably rip off the Fn key and longer the Ctrl somehow :()
Thank you
Zoltan
August 28th, 2006 at 8:58 am
I have the same issue with the Z60t. Very frustrating, and I haven’t found a key remapper that works either. I agree that Lenovo should provide options when purchasing and a remapper for those of use that already have machines. If I don’t get this fixed I’ll probaby dump the lenovo and go back to my Dell. Why didn’t they randomize the keyboard while they were at it? QWERTY is so overrated ;)
August 28th, 2006 at 11:52 am
Hi, thanks for the comments. I’m glad I wasn’t the only one frustrated by the key placement, it just doesn’t make sense to me. I was never able to remap the keys, thus I sent the notebook back to Lenovo for a refund.
Just a heads up, it appears that Gateway puts the FN key to the far left also on their notebooks.
I still haven’t decided what I’m going to purchase. I’m having a hard time finding something I like. I hate the glossy screens, so I’m trying to avoid that. I was set on the Latitude D620, but apparently it has some screen issues. Check out some of my latest postings for a link to that.
Goodluck! Let me know what notebook you end up getting if you return your Lenovo. Cheers!
August 28th, 2006 at 7:51 pm
Please, please, please won’t somebody solve the Fn/Ctrl issue! I seriously am going nuts here. >:(
What a usability nightmare!
August 28th, 2006 at 7:56 pm
I though I was the ONLY one!! x60s and $2500 latrer it cant do it HELP,., If anybody finds a fix email me! jvaccone@excelmicro.com
August 28th, 2006 at 8:48 pm
I say just return it if you’re not happy. I wish I knew the keyboard issue before hand.
August 31st, 2006 at 11:31 am
I was reading a review that said that this wasn’t a negative, but I completely disagree — it’s a human factors and usability issue.
In switching the FN and CTRL keys, Lenovo is breaking Fitt’s Law, the logic of which states that corners and edges are easier and faster for people to reach than objects in the middle of any target area (that’s why the window close icon and the Window’s Start menu button are on the corners):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fitt%27s_law
Since the CTRL key is used more often than the FN key in day to day computing, it makes sense to place the CTRL key in a place where it could be found by touch without resorting to looking down at the keyboard.
Now, everytime I hit FN-C and FN-V when I meant to cut and paste with CTRL-C and CTRL-V, it makes me mad enough to want to write a rant.
Janice
September 1st, 2006 at 11:49 am
unfortunately, the FN key cannot be remapped to another key. i have a gateway laptop and yes, they do also have the FN key on the very bottom left.
after doing some research, the way that keyboards work in windows is that each key coresponds to a certain scancode which tells the OS what to do.
however, the FN key doesnt return a scancode to the OS but rather modifies the scancode of the key that it is press with.
i believe that laptop keyboards have different circuitry than desktop keyboards which enables them to do things like set the brightness/contrast in hardware (using the Fn key), and this bypasses the normal BIOS systems - in effect, the system never actually sees the Fn key, so you can’t remap it in XP.
a bummer, yes, but maybe in the future companies will take these complaints into account and place that damn Fn key elsewhere.
September 13th, 2006 at 4:00 pm
Hello
+1 for the massive irritation caused by the Fn key. If I go onsite to a client to do more than a few hours work I now take a USB keyboard with me.
Another one, probably bigger than the Fn key issue is the placement of the Home and End keys up at the top. The never used forwards and back are sat there as perfect contenders for Home and End but I am yet to find a way to re-map these either. *sob*. I had a lovely Vaio Z1 for three years until my son dropped it. It Just Worked and had everything where I wanted it.
Darren Beale
September 13th, 2006 at 5:12 pm
I’m glad I’m not alone on this. Let me say this, I’ll never purchase a notebook with this keyboard configuration.
September 18th, 2006 at 12:58 am
[…] Standard Keyboard with Ctrl and Fn in the correct spot. […]
February 6th, 2007 at 6:23 pm
Any update or fix to this? Our office makes me use this any I am seriously going nuts, if there is any hope please advise. Thanks.
February 6th, 2007 at 6:39 pm
My fix was to return it. What a shame, I feel your pain. :( Also gateway using this configuration. Don’t know what to tell ya.
Maybe you can plug in an external keyboard, and/or get a docking station..
Cheers
February 9th, 2007 at 7:45 am
What a hassle. I cut and paste constantly. I tried using the free AutoHotKey utility which can map the function key to an extent. The following script will map the “FN then C” and “FN then V” to be Ctrl+C and Ctrl+v. However, you must RELEASE the function key prior to hitting the “C” or “V”. I’m hoping I can now remap my stubborn brain to remember to let go of that misplaced function key prior to hitting the C or V.
~SC163 up::
; map the function key to cut and paste
keystowatch=c,v
Input, OneKey, T2 L1,,%keystowatch%
if (errorlevel == “Match”)
Send {CTRL Down}%OneKey%{CTRL Up}
return
February 23rd, 2007 at 8:59 am
The layout is perfect for me, I like it. Esc and F1 keys are also at very good position.
Thanks to IBM and Lenovo for not listening such people.
Buy yourself some ASUS/Dell with their ugly enter/shift/backspace/pgup/pgdn/delete/insert and leave IBM for professionals.
February 23rd, 2007 at 6:48 pm
Guys, you’re doing it all wrong. It’s not the Fn key that is in a wrong place, it’s the Ctrl-key that has been incorrectly placed on all modern PC keyboards.
On good keyboards, the Ctrl-key is where the PC has the completely useless Caps Lock.
Read here how to make the Caps Lock turn into a Ctrl-key, and stop breaking your pinky-finger each time you need to use the Ctrl-key: http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/device/input/w2kscan-map.mspx
March 8th, 2007 at 9:57 am
I too am feeling a good deal of rage at this keyboard fiasco. I’m trying to get used to it, but it’s like finding a brick glued to your new sneakers.
Pipe’s suggestion above is a good one, although mildly painful in itself (don’t forget your bit-endian direction when editing the registry!). If only it would move the key down into the corner where I have grown so very used to it being there…
March 17th, 2007 at 3:33 pm
Add me to your list of frustrated folks. After quickly blogging on it noticed your post and long string of comments. Misery loves company I suppose?
v -> whoops … did it again. (Fn-v) ;-)
http://blog.myarchive.us/?p=738
March 19th, 2007 at 10:34 am
I glued the FN and Ctrl keys together. When I press either key, both are pressed. Amazingly, when I press them together, it activates the Control function as intended, and the Function function, as intended.
I’m set.
D’de
March 29th, 2007 at 7:38 pm
#1-that fn key is there to provide easier access to the fn combos (like the thinklight, bottom and top corners of the keyboard are easy to find in the dark)
#2 For those who DON’T like the feature, look for sharpkeys, it might be able to help you. It is possible to change the fn through the registry, I just don’t know how. If anyone DOES find a way, I’m looking to add features to the fn combos!!!
March 30th, 2007 at 4:37 am
Argh! Just got a new worklaptop, T60, and I’m getting furious about this Fn and Ctrl-misplacement. This is driving me nuts! I think I’m going to get this back sooner or later and get a Dell or something like that. Other than this key-issue, the T60 seems to be pretty good.
April 12th, 2007 at 6:50 am
Such a shame! ALIENWARE also put this useless Fn key on their keyboard..and they are meant for gaming!
i liked so much Area-51® m5790 but I’m not going to torture myself carring all the time second keyboard because of this.:S
pipe Says:
February 23rd, 2007 at 6:48 pm Guys, you’re doing it all wrong. It’s not the Fn key that is in a wrong place, it’s the Ctrl-key that has been incorrectly placed on all modern PC keyboards.
man, every single keyboard i have till now was withCTRL key on left..as someone said before, its against nature putting the most used keys anywhere but at the periphery. Im used to have my Delete key in top right as well.
p.s. The guy designed - approved - manufactured Fn key at this position must being on heavy drugs…i belive he must habbit somewhere in to deep cave under the main Apple office :>…slap him hard if u find him!!
May 28th, 2007 at 11:49 am
Truk, you CANNOT map the Fn key! Don’t just “say stuff” that you haven’t checked out - especially when so many other people have!
Davide Andrea appears to have the best solution:
Glued the FN and Ctrl keys together!
June 7th, 2007 at 12:47 pm
My wife’s Acer Aspire 5112 has the Ctrl and Fn keys in the correct positions - nice big Ctrl in the corner, small Fn key directly to its right. I don’t mind the Fn position on old Thinkpads because it was nice and big, but on my new X60 Tablet they’ve added all the crap windows keys and now I sometimes hit those by accident.
June 7th, 2007 at 4:52 pm
Most people don’t learn all the windows key shortcuts. However, I use it quite often and really like it. =]
August 17th, 2007 at 10:12 am
I also am annoyed about this with my T60, and am not likely to buy another such computer. My colleagues feel the same way.
Gluing the keys together has not worked for me.
August 30th, 2007 at 8:47 am
On my Lenovo ThinkPad X60 I removed the Fn key itself leaving only the little blue “nubbin” that they key presses. I can still easily use Fn if necessary (rarely) but now it’s impossible for my pinky to mistake that spot for the real Ctrl key. The Ctrl key still feels not quite in the right place (and looks funny) but it’s a big improvement.
September 10th, 2007 at 5:13 pm
this fn | ctrl key thing is nothing new and hasn’t been changed recently at all. At college i was given a T30 in 2002, a T42 in 2004 and at work I’ve been issued a T42p and now a T60p
on every single one the keyboard layout is exactly the same. And you know what? I like it the way it is. As for the home and end keys being where they are thats fine… THEY ARE USELESS. in any single editor there is always a better shortcut for home and end, in emacs & linux its ctrl-a|e… i use the forward and backwards keys all the time in windows and linux to move forwards and backwards in browsers, and mapping other actions to them.
caps lock has been like that on sun keyboards for years, personally i like the symmetry of control on the bottom row because of the amount of use it gets from emacs and linux commands
If you are a touch typer i dont see how the control key is a problem, you can actually reach it. where as i can’t reach the Fn key without lifting up my hands. so either you have enourmour hands or you aren’t a touch typer. personally i also like how easy it is to find the fn key to turn on off the lights.
the more wasted button is the stupid menu button between alt and control on the right which along with the windows key is a relatively new addition to the keyboard, but a good one because in linux thats my Super key.
that said i just got a kinesis advantage and thats the bomb… although even that has some quirks im working on.. despite remapping its confusing to look down at the thumbs when i explain that delete isnt delete but its control.
even if it is an adjustment, you will get used to it, despite what others tell you.
September 25th, 2007 at 2:02 pm
Good to find folks that are just as aggravated about such a seemingly innocuous problem. When I try to explain the problem to coworkers- who all have Dells and many of them have trouble using the mouse, let alone the key board- they have no idea why it bugs me.
I actually called Lenovo today to try to fix the problem. The hardware folks didn’t have a solution, but told me that software could help. I got the software side and they said they could absolutely remap the key, but that it would cost $100 (the price of them handling a single issue) for me to find out how.
I haven’t yet decided if I am going to spend $100 to fix something that, at the very least, should be a user-configurable setting. But if I do, you can bet I’ll come back here and post the resolution for everyone else that goes stuck with this crap.
October 14th, 2007 at 4:14 am
David T; please do!
This Fn-Ctrl placement is serious crap.
If it wasn’t for my IBM-centered workplace I would surely have tossed this T60 out!!
October 23rd, 2007 at 10:29 pm
I used PC Magazine’s TradeKeys utility http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2704,1656363,00.asp to swap the left control key with CapsLock. Works like a charm.
December 13th, 2007 at 4:48 am
This is such an anoying thing. the fn key is a real pain. not found anything to fix this on my samsung. total crap. I won’t be buying another laptop without the fn key in the right place :(
January 13th, 2008 at 8:59 am
Can anybody point me to the definition of all Fn keys on Lenovo T-61.
I have searched a lot and I am unable to find documentation regd. the same.
January 28th, 2008 at 11:08 am
I’ve taped a small paperclip over the two of the two keys — this is similar in principle to the gluing idea but perhaps less permanent :-)
January 28th, 2008 at 11:08 am
sorry, that should’ve read “top of the two keys” …
January 29th, 2008 at 4:34 am
If you use a hot melt gluegun, you can glue it non-permanently. If you want to unstick them, just remove the two keys from the keyboard and use freshly boiled water to remove it. There should be no lasting marks.
Note that glue guns come in two flavours - hot and low melt temperatures and take their matching own sticks. Most are the “hot” type and thats what you want. The lower temperature glue is probably not suitable with hotter laptops like the Thinkpad X60/61. It won’t melt all over the surface of your keyboard, but it will probably not hold the keys together.
Because glue gun glue is also bead-like, you can bridge the gap between the two keys easily unlike other glues, and looks a helluva a lot more attractive than a paperclip and tape. ;)
February 14th, 2008 at 8:01 am
Obviously Fn and Ctrl keys can not be swapped by Windows and there is no new Bios from Lenovo that can do this. Anyone tried the hard way - to open the keyboard and swap the wires below the keys or something like that?
February 20th, 2008 at 3:17 am
Davide Andrea officially wins my genius nomination for the year. You can in fact glue the Fn and Ctrl keys together - and each key functions as it should. Awesome. I’ll be picking up some spare keys to experiment with how best to ‘bridge’ these two keys without affecting the ‘aesthetics’ of the keyboard (probably from underneath).
February 29th, 2008 at 5:02 pm
WTF is Lenovo (not) doing?? Other manufacturers has had a BIOS option for this for ages!
C’mon there’s atleast 40 of us out here that needs this ASAP!
/John
March 2nd, 2008 at 6:01 pm
Hi,
any tips on how to glue the FN and CTRL keys together ?
I am using the Samsung R70 with this layout and would like to give it a go as well. Currently, I am using the CAPS-LOCK remapping approach. It’s ok, but still requires me to switch between the desktop and notebook layout on a daily basis.
I am interested in the following from someone who actually tried it:
- Type of glue used and where it can be purchased
- If i should remove the keys from the keyboard prior to glueing (might be hard to re-attach them once glued together)
- If the keys should be glued from the top or from the bottom. I suppose from the top in order to bridge the gap between them.
Thanks
March 31st, 2008 at 12:09 pm
I recently sold an Asus tablet in a few months after getting tired of the bad Fn key placement. The Caps Lock position is equally straining on the pinky, but reversing the more commonly used Ctrl with Fn is even worse since you have to bend in the pinky. Besides, when your fingers have been “trained” for years to use the Ctrl on the far bottom left, its hard and very inconvenient to change just because the manufacturer thought for you.
I use Ctrl more than just copy/pasting (such as going through chunks of code). AutoHotKey definitely won’t help you and neither will most manufacturers.
You’re better off keeping the Fn location in your share of mind. I thought the Lenovo X300 was going to be the big contender as my next laptop, then I remembered Fn placement, and there it was in the worst location. No dice.
April 8th, 2008 at 8:07 pm
What a pile of poo IBM/Lenovo is. Having the Fn key in the wrong position is really getting on my ****, not to mention all the other problems I’m having with it. As for those that say the Ctrl key is in the wrong location I disagree. With having the Ctrl key in the bottom left it makes it easy to locate by touch and then acts as a reference point for the other keys.
This is one MAJOR point that puts me off IBM/Lenovo. Bring on Dell!
April 14th, 2008 at 1:08 pm
Hi, I have lenovo and fn key on bottom left corner, I can’t use this keyboard normally, and I don’t know what a stupid idiot make that misteake. Every keybord on the world have ctrl key there. IBM is couple of shit for me, not worth spend money on it. Maybe they start to thinking if they loose many customers about stupid decision of making keyboard unusable.
April 23rd, 2008 at 9:37 pm
Oh boy, I’m in the same trap!
I also called IBM support and got nada … all they said is that there is no way to switch it around. Did any one try to open the keyboard and somehow link FN and CTRL? similar the the glue (awesome) idea but just under the keyboard so you can’t notice it?
May 3rd, 2008 at 5:10 pm
Super annoying. I found this site after searching for a way to swap the Fn and Ctrl keys. Now I’m extremely upset that I can’t do that… totally sucks, I should have bought a Dell instead.
May 13th, 2008 at 7:48 pm
Wild.
Gorilla tape and a toothpick split in two. What idiot put the fn key there?